Blown Head Gasket

[Zippy]

I'm pretty sure I've blown the head gasket in my 78 Spider. Shortly after I had the carb rebuilt I took her out for a spin. She was running better than ever. I went to get on the freeway and revved her up through the gears. Wow! She was pulling strong, when all of a sudden she lost power and started to rumble and shake. I coasted to the next exit and limped back to the storage place I kept her while I finished my kitchen remodel. I checked the compression and found zero on cylinders 3 and 4. I left her in storage, that was last fall.

I just brought her home last weekend. Gave her a wash and started diagnosis. I used my compressor and found I had air flow from 3 to 4 with the valves closed. Now comes the fun part. I am not a mechanic but I want to do this myself. That's why there are lots of questions. Any tips about the best way to go about a head gasket replacement would be greatly appreciated.

My car was rebuilt by the previous owner, my former neighbor. I watched him reassemble the engine and helped hold things a few times. I know a few things about the engine. The number stamped on the block is 132 xy 0406, the x being a stamp over the number 2 which makes it illegible, the y being possibly a 1 but it is only half as tall as the first 1. The number on the head is 132AB 9A 0000 40/4. My cams are 1600A. Not sure what the A stands for. I have the receipt from the shop that did the heads and may have done some other work for him but I can't find it right now. Not sure it's even important.

The engine has never overheated. It only has about 6000 miles on it since the rebuild. Do I really need to have the head resurfaced? How many times can this be done before the head has to be replaced? It may already be at the end.

When I looked at the cam wheels I noticed one is different than the other. It doesn't have the hole to line up with the pointer. Is there another way to make sure I get the cams lined up when I put it back together? Is there any way to do this without the special tool? If not is there a sourcce for the tool?

I have heard that there are different types of head gaskets. What is the best and who should I get it from? Are there different thickness gaskets? How do I make sure I am getting the right one to fit my engine?

I have heard that you should replace the timing belt every time you take it off to do any work. Any thoughts. Where can I get the best belt? How can I make sure I am getting the right one for my engine?

Thanks in advance for your help.

Al

[racydave]

I am just curious as to why the head gasket blew. Was it installed dry, or were any sealers applied? The newer style gaskets are permiated with epoxys already and should go on dry. Was the head re-surfaced at that time? I think letting someone inspect the head like Mark, or Jon Logan might be a good idea. Good luck...

[mdrburchette]

I've never had a problem with the head gaskets from IAP. I would also get the timing belt from one of our vendors and since they're not that expensive, I'd go ahead and replace it. Since the car has run 6000 miles, I doubt you have a problem with timing. Try setting it to tdc so you can mark the cam wheel that doesn't have an alignment mark.

[So Cal Mark]

blaming the gasket for failing is like blaming a gun for killing someone.

[Zippy]

Dave, not sure how the gasket went in, it was over ten years ago. The head was not just resurfaced but completly gone thru, new valves, guides, port and polish, everything. The engine was "balanced and blueprinted" according to the PO. High compresion pistons 10.9:1 I think.

Denise, thanks for the tips. I have bought from IAP before and didn't have any problems with them. Just looking for the best gasket for my situation.

Mark, I didn't blame the gastket, I said, "I'm pretty sure I've blown the head gasket in my 78 Spider. " I may have over-revved the engine in my exuberance about how well it was running.

Al

[manoa matt]

Vendors usually stock the "Tako" gasket. Red pre-formed silicone is the tell tale sign. Try and find a Fel-Pro gasket or a Goetze gasket. The fel-pro should be available through a local auto parts store, but will probably need to be ordered.

[baltobernie]

Hey Al, sorry for your misfortune. But glad to see you're willing to have a go at this major, but doable home job.

First do a search on this great forum on "cylinder head removal (or repair)" and see some the excellent tips previous posters have suggested. "While the head is Off" is another good thread.

After you remove the head, a machine shop can check it for flatness for around $30. No sense removing material unless necessary, particularly if you suspect its been cut before, and absolutely if you are already on the high side of compression.

Then its just a matter of buttoning everything back up correctly. See other threads on timing belt installation tips and tricks.

[Zippy]

Thanks for all the tips. I went and read all the posts I could find about replacing the head gasket, engine rebuilding, valve timing, etc. It sounds like there are a lot of great people on this forum. I also looked on You Tube at videos of Leak Down Test and replacing head gaskets, some of them were pretty down and dirty. I am asking a lot of questions because of all the things that can go wrong with a FIAT. And because I don't want to have to do it over. I want to get this done and enjoy the rest of the summer with a working automobile.

What I understand now is that I need to have the head checked for warp because if it is warped it will blow out the new gasket. If it is warped and needs to be cut down I need to make sure there is enough material to do this and if there's not, I need a new head. Pray for me.....

Do I reuse the existing head bolts or should I get new ones? I read something about stretch bolts or bolts that have stretched but never found a positive answer. How can I tell if the bolts are stretched? Do I need to wait until I have the head off to see what type and length they are? If I take too much material off the head the bolts may bottom out. What do I do them, cut them off or are shorter bolts available.

I can't find the Fel Pro or Geotze gaskets, any suggestions on where to go? Bayless is the only one that refers to head gaskets for high compression engines. It makes me wonder if the PO of my car used the right gasket.

Finally does anyone know of a good shop in the Seattle area where I can have the head checked and or cut? I would prefer a shop that has FIAT experience. When I did the head on my 88 Mitsubishi the "best high performance shop in town" screwed it up so bad they had to buy me a new head. Something happened with the cutter and it dove into the head and cut a swath right through it.

Thanks again for the help.

Al

[racydave]

This company is in the NW, You might ask them... http://www.performancefiat.com/catalog/index.php/

[engineerted]

http://www.rockauto.com/catalog/raframecatalog.php

Rockauto.com

Ted

[mdrburchette]

Rock Auto is showing a Fel-Pro for the 1756 but not for a 1608. What a bummer.

[manoa matt]

He's got a 78 1800, head gaskets a plenty.

http://shop.oreillyauto.com/ProductDeta ... ber=21201B

http://www.autozone.com/autozone/catalo ... d=cat30061

[Zippy]

Thanks for all the links and info. I guess the Felpro is the gasket I'll get. I haven't found anyone with an opinion on the Bayless gasket for high compression engines. Also, it sounds like several people have successfully built performance engines with the Felpro gaskets.

Found several posts indicating it is okay to reuse the head bolts as long as they torque properly. I will chase the holes to clean them out. These bolts get anti sieze right? I found a couple of references to removing the bolts in a specific order and putting them back in the same holes in the reverse order. I have not found any reference to what the order is. Anyone?

I will take the head to a shop to have it checked. Will I need to remove the manifolds if they have to machine it?

I start the disassembly today.

Al

[AlfaSeltzer]

If you're still looking, I have a gasket set for the 1800 with a goetze head gasket, valve stem seals, intake/exhaust gaskets, cam seals, etc.

[Zippy]

AlfaSeltzer,

Thanks, but I already ordered them from Vick Autosports.

Al