How to set float level on DFEV?

[SteinOnkel]

I might have a swag for you here.

Get the gas out of your float bowl somehow. Run the car without the fuel pump connected until it dies, for example. Then pop the top off of the carb and fill your float bowl by hand. Slowly. You should get to a point where the fuel is being dumped into the engine. Stop here and make a mark inside your float bowl. Empty the bowl again and set your float so that it reaches that mark on its own.

Might get you into the ballpark at least. Just a theory.

[wetminkey]

The Redline Fuel Management paper I spoke of, included with my Redline kit,....


And the 2mm needle travel 'business', stapled to the previous:


I'm guessing that I should set my float to 18mm and 23mm,...! Ya think?

[18Fiatsandcounting]

Definitely. You should be good with 18 mm from the gasket surface to the top of the (plastic) float when the float hinge tang is just touching the needle valve (top cover held vertically), and 23 mm for this same distance when the float is swung all the way open.

By the way, the DGV, DFAV, DGEV, etc. are all basically the same carb. F and G are just mirror images of each other (for mounting on different engines), D is just Doppio (Italian) for Dual (two barrels), and A, E, and no letter are either the option of a coolant choke (Agua or A), electric choke (E), or a manual choke (no letter). Maybe this is common knowledge, maybe not. The V stands for either Vertical or power Valve, depending on who you ask. I've also heard that the D stands for Downdraft.

-Bryan

[wetminkey]

Carb's on the bench. I have NO IDEA of what the float level settings should be!!
DFEV settings are different than DGV settings, and the paperwork that came with my Redline kit (for DFEV, DFAV) is all DGV,...three pages of it!
Redline's website has parts diagrams,...I can see the settings! DFEV 38.5mm and 46.5mm,........DGEV 40mm and 50mm,...to bottom of float. That puts the top of my float 7mm from the gasket!
This is INSANE! I've emailed Redline to find out what the HELL?!!
Does anybody KNOW the answer (NO GUESSES!),....? Perhaps geospider? I believe that he runs a DFEV,...
I do not understand why this has to be SO difficult.

[18Fiatsandcounting]

Is your float brass or plastic?

[wetminkey]

Plastic.
I have gone over multiple sources, and I believe that 18mm from the top of the float, including the gasket is proper. That is without Redline's input,...they have not answered yet.
And I'm guessing that 2mm of float travel is probably also correct, so I've re-set my float to 18mm and 23mm, despite the DGV paperwork. I'd like to hear what Redline has to say,...
I know that this is due to variations in the type of float, but with multiple measurements and methods recommended, and the fact that my car has been drowning ever since I installed this carb (ran worse after re-setting the float to the settings that I found!), I find this to be ridiculously stupid.
WHY does the brand new Redline carb not come properly set (+ why does my float hardware look oddly bent), and WHY is it difficult to find out what the proper settings should be?
I still have to find out what the fast idle screw setting should be - it is not mentioned in the Redline literature that came with the DFEV,...!
Kinda stupid, I think,...for a company responsible for sales and tech for Weber.

[18Fiatsandcounting]

WHY does the brand new Redline carb not come properly set (+ why does my float hardware look oddly bent), and WHY is it difficult to find out what the proper settings should be?

Because the carburetor settings, including the float level, depend on the engine and the intended use for the car. Engine size, camshaft timing / lift / duration, intake and exhaust systems, compression ratio and ignition timing, whether the goal is fuel economy, meeting emissions standards, or maximum power (across all rpms or just at 6000-8000 rpm?), whether the car is a daily driver for Joe Average or a rally car (bouncy? offroad?) or a racing car --- all are factors in how the carb should be set up. I would think that, if you told Redline that your purchased 32/36 DFEV was for an 1800 cc Fiat street car with stock cams, they should be able to give some general guidance, but that appears not to the case.

Try 18 mm and 23 mm. That should be close enough for now.

[wetminkey]

Float level depends on the carb, nothing else. How could it?

[wetminkey]

An example of the BS I have been dealing with, in the way of answers,...
I got this back from Redline:


Bud Pauge <budp@worldpac.com>
Mon 11/18/2019 6:26 PM
todd please confirm your location and the application the DFEV carburetor you own is mounted on
Please also send a picture of the carburetor for reference to its mounting and system lay out
if this is a fresh rebuild please confirm the dealer that supplied your carburetor rebuild kit and are you aware if it is a genuine redline or Weber carburetor rebuild kit
I would ask for reference to confirm more about your location and application and again presuming this is a fresh or in process of being rebuilt please confirm the issues that you were having and dealing with before you rebuilt the carburetor
I would be interested in the engine application and engine size along with your current best idle settings and current full calibration
The conflct in these situations is a conflect of presumed tuning function and out line.
for example there is a holley known as a holley Weber. Weber developed this carburetor for ford and when the pinto was then made later here in the states Weber sold a license to both holley and motorcraft to copy there carburetor these two companys did just that and made production changes for a cost factor based on how they delt with there own carburetors and these changes produced a different out come to the point in a raceing application there can be as much as a 1.5 to 2 seconds a lap in total time and distance speed on a 2.5 to 3.5 mile road course.
This from a company who was give the rights to copy the unit correctly and made changes based on there own history.
so this brings us to those from China that have now kocked this off with out paying the piper they not only do it as a knock off they also have no idea how it works and have there own variations
So with that most of what becomes a conflict is information handed out with out condideration of the situation the current fuels and engine variables and what current day issues exist with todays current emissions fuel and ignition event.
Please take a picture of the carburetor your working on and confirm your specific situation and issues. Please confirm a phone contact so we might offer our input directly to you
This is not information we are willing to debate there are as noted competitors who mis using our name and history and we have no need to offer them any guidance and input on how they might deal with there own issues.
so This information is for your needs not for a public forum. Others have there own history and points of good luck meaning Im not here to say what worked for someone else was right or wrong based on there situation I cannot confirm for your issue and how it relates and our settings reflect what we know about fuel both with in the Americas and world wide some fuels now burn and have a weight and burn rate relative to something like 18 and 20% alcohol with out there being any specific alcohol in the fuels which now have a high synthetic fuel blended content.
So there are only Weber calibration and settings that reflect the origonal production point and use for the carburetor we strongl suggest that is what makes our conversions different from other econo conversions we completely change up the base lines based on current markets and current fuel situations .
Our settings are for the help and assistance of our customers and note posted typiclly on line. They are avalable through Redline and Weber direct technical support
Please confirm what you can and please confirm a picture of your carburetor and some information on your issues and application use.
Your location is as important as any of the physical settings.
Bud Pauge
Redline



On 11/18/2019 12:55 PM, Todd Compton wrote:
Information seems to be terribly conflicting!
How is the float level set on the DFEV (with plastic float), and to what settings?
Thank you,
Todd Compton.


This is making me crazy! I think I'll just make up some shit and go with that!

[wetminkey]

I can tell that I'm going to be at this for a LONG time,...

[SteinOnkel]

I'm going to paraphrase that e-mail to save everyone the trouble "Wah! China bad! Wah! Ethanol bad! Wah!" .

They know they distribute an inferior product and they are quick to blame everyone else, except themselves. Not sharing infos publicly? Pathetic. Nothing has changed at that company in the last three years since I dealt with them.

To your issue: you're overthinking it. The float is only there to supply the idle circuit and mains with adequate fuel. That's it. Set it to any of the specs you've found and it'll be fine. No way is it going to be something that's down to less than one mm.

The whole song and dance about racecars is just more Redline "smoke and mirrors" so you don't join their elitist club of people with working Webers lol.

I've had dual Solexes before that would starve for fuel on the Autobahn. I'm talking at upwards of 6000rpm in 5th gear - so at around a buck twenty. It would stall stall stall then suddenly bam it would be back. So you pull over, set the floats higher. Still doing it? Bump up the fuel pressure. Done. That was all done by trail and error, not some gatekept spec from a vendor with a stick up his...

Cheers
Steiny

[wetminkey]

Problem is, I see multiple specs, from different sources, that are all over the place! Old measuring method (gasket to bottom of float, or no gasket in the measurement), new measuring method (gasket to top of float), and the "needle drop" method for the float's lower setting,...
The only thing that I see that is FAIRLY consistent may be the "18mm, gasket to top of float", measurement. And the float position looks proper when set to that level. Two millimeters of needle drop also makes sense to me and also 'looks' correct.
Previous settings of 38.5mm and 46.5mm were WAY off,...those are found in the left-hand lower corner of the Redline Weber 32/36 DFEV parts diagram,...!
Hard to set a float level when everyone has a different answer,...and the "experts" simply babble!
Too much misinformation purported to be fact.

To end this lengthy thread, I'm going to ASSUME that 18mm and 2mm needle drop is correct (that puts the float at about the stated 23mm), for now. I'll not know until I can run the engine again,...
Todd.

[wetminkey]

Well, nothing new, except that I have several more opinions (each different) about what the DFEV's float setting should be,...and my car is still not running well.
Tore down the "new" carb and rebuilt it. Pretty CRISPY diaphragms and gasket for a one year old carb with no use! Fuel stained plastic strainer and some discolored brass surfaces. It's been a year, but this looks more like very old NOS, or sold after some light use as "new". Carb is shiny,...pretty.
"Made in Spain" and "by LCN" cast on the side. "32 36 DFAV 23A 18G" stamped into the side of the base plate.
I also question if this unfinished fuel passageway, to the right of the main jets, is supposed to be open:

It could be a normal variation, but I'm trying to check everything,...
Can anyone provide comparison pics of their DFEV/DFAV's bowl? Thanks!

[geospider]

here is the picture I believe I e mailed you. My old 32/36
yes, the opening on right side I believe should be there. yours looks blocked. One of my previous thoughts was that your carb may have a manufacturing flaw. You may have found that.

Geo

[wetminkey]

Maybe not,...focodave's DGV looks exactly the same inside! No fuel passage out of the bowl on the primary side, next to the main jets,...Perhaps the newer variations of the DFV/DGV did not have the passageway,...
I'll expect to hear from Redline, about float settings, on Monday,...
Thanks, geo!