Front Sway Bar Question

[Vandrid]

I was trying to remove my front sway bar when one of the nuts that holds the stabilizer bracket is spinning in place. I can't tell if the bolt is a post or if its welded to the car and also cannot figure out a way to remove the nut. Even if a remove the nut how am I to re secure the bracket once I put the sway bar back?

Any help on this would be great. Thanks

[18Fiatsandcounting]

In my spiders, the anti-sway bar is secured by four brackets (two on the "frame rails" and one on each lower A-arm). These brackets are each held in place with two studs welded either to the frame rail or the A-arm, along with two nuts/washers. Yours is probably the same.

To remove nuts that just spin but don't come off, I've had some luck jamming a small flat-bladed screwdriver, or a putty knife or the tip of a small chisel, under the nut and using that as leverage to "lift up" on the nut as you turn it. If that doesn't work, you should be able to grind off the nut with a Dremel tool or the like, but that would probably be a pain.

Once the nut is removed, you have several choices. If the stud threads are OK and it's the nut that is stripped, you lucked out and can just replace the nut. If the stud threads are the problem (most likely), you can try to cut new threads on them with a die for a slightly smaller nut size, perhaps even non-metric. That won't be as strong as the original, but it might work. Or, you can drill out the center of the stud, retap for a smaller diameter bolt, and then use a bolt to secure that particular part of the bracket. Another option is to bend the bracket somewhat so that you can retap a new hole for a bolt in a slightly different location, but it's likely that this won't be as strong as the original either.

Either way, sounds like you might have some drilling and thread cutting to do, unless it's just a bad nut. Good luck!

-Bryan

[Vandrid]

In my spiders, the anti-sway bar is secured by four brackets (two on the "frame rails" and one on each lower A-arm). These brackets are each held in place with two studs welded either to the frame rail or the A-arm, along with two nuts/washers. Yours is probably the same.

To remove nuts that just spin but don't come off, I've had some luck jamming a small flat-bladed screwdriver, or a putty knife or the tip of a small chisel, under the nut and using that as leverage to "lift up" on the nut as you turn it. If that doesn't work, you should be able to grind off the nut with a Dremel tool or the like, but that would probably be a pain.

Once the nut is removed, you have several choices. If the stud threads are OK and it's the nut that is stripped, you lucked out and can just replace the nut. If the stud threads are the problem (most likely), you can try to cut new threads on them with a die for a slightly smaller nut size, perhaps even non-metric. That won't be as strong as the original, but it might work. Or, you can drill out the center of the stud, retap for a smaller diameter bolt, and then use a bolt to secure that particular part of the bracket. Another option is to bend the bracket somewhat so that you can retap a new hole for a bolt in a slightly different location, but it's likely that this won't be as strong as the original either.

Either way, sounds like you might have some drilling and thread cutting to do, unless it's just a bad nut. Good luck!

-Bryan

Yeah that is what I was thinking, just didn't know if there was some way of doing it I didn't know about. Thanks for the feedback. Time to get back under there and figure it out

[18Fiatsandcounting]

One other thought: Since your bracket is still attached, you could clamp a vise-grip on that and pull on it, while you are trying to loosen the nut. Pulling on the bracket might "push" on the nut enough to allow it to spin off. Or, as suggested above, put a screwdriver under the bracket and use that as a lever to put pressure on the nut as you loosen it.

-Bryan

[Vandrid]

I used a nut spliter and took it off that way. As suspected, the bolt is smooth, so now on to the die kit. Another question, how do you pull apart the lower and upper bracket on the sway bar, mine seem to be stuck pretty tight. Is it just a go at it with force thing or is there something else I'm missing? My service manual isn't much help here...

[18Fiatsandcounting]

Another question, how do you pull apart the lower and upper bracket on the sway bar, mine seem to be stuck pretty tight.

The anti-sway bars are missing on both of my cars (something I need to fix someday), so I'm going by memory here. I recall that the two halves of the two middle brackets are spot welded together in a few areas, so if you're trying to separate them a bit to replace the rubber bushings, I think the solution is just good old force. Perhaps some WD-40 or the like sprayed around the rubber edges, and trying to work a screwdriver around the rubber bushing to force them out? You don't want to bend the metal too much or your new rubber bushings might not stay in place.

I also vaguely recall that the brackets on the ends were just a clamp (like a 2-hole electrical conduit clamp) that secures onto the studs on the lower A-arm. Remove the two nuts, the clamp comes off, and the rubber bushing slides off the end of the anti-sway bar.

-Bryan

[Vandrid]

Yeah the end bushings I'm not having a problem with, its the inner bushings that don't seem to budge. I sprayed WD-40, went at it for about and hour and maybe got one to move half an inch. They spin a bit, with a lot of force, but don't want to come out and definitely don't want to be removed from the brackets...

[dinghyguy]

I think mine were flanged over kinda like a river at the bolt location
I used a largedrill bit and just released the flange a bit until I could pry them apart
I tried not to increase the hole dia

Oh and broke 1 stud. So I drilled it out and installed a new one then spot welded it

My average seems to be about 8 bolts before something breaks!
Cheers & good luck
Dinghyguy

[JohnMc]

I drilled out the holes in the brackets but ended up buying new ones. I do not know why one cannot buy new brackets with new rubber - would make it so much simpler. After getting it done would have been worth easily $100 extra to me.

[Vandrid]

Okay so I drilled out the holes, got them apart. Got the car back to one piece (minus Sway bar) now I cant seem to fit the middle brackets around the new bushings... Am I missing something? I feel like if I tray to force them on the studs the studs will snap. I have read they have a tendency to do that, so I don't want to risk it. Any ideas on how to solve this one?

[dinghyguy]

I put a bit of lube on the studs so when i torqued them down to compress the bushing the force was more in tension along the bolt than in shear from the torqueing. (i broke 1 stud undoing them). I had no problem compressing the rubber, but mine were not fancy urethane.

dinghyguy

[Vandrid]

Well as I feared I snapped a stud. And I also have no welding experience of any sort so looks like it’s time to tow the car to the mechanic and throw in the towel

[DieselSpider]

Sometimes your better off putting an angle grinder or muffler cutoff to the old brackets to save the studs when removing the old ones and just installing new brackets instead of trying to force old rusty ones off.

Less than $40 for a new set of brackets compared to all the muss and fuss to save a set of frozen rusty old ones.

If your intent on reusing the old brackets then drilling the rubber out helps make it much easier. Once the old bushing is out then you can use a rotary wire brush to clean the rest out and polish them up inside to make installing the new bushings easier. Be sure to slather the molybdenum grease on them when installing them.

For reinstalling them I will sometimes use an old wooden clamp to compress them so I do not have to force them on the studs. You can also compress them in a vice and use mechanics wire to hold them to the correct dimensions and then just clip the wire once they are almost completely tightened back up to the frame.

Be sure to use plenty of PBlaster (much better than Liquid Wrench) and to run a die over the studs to clean up the threads before trying to install the new brackets. That said some of the fasteners Fiat used back then do appear prone to severe embrittlement over time and highly prone to failure such as the bolts embedded in the rubber caps finishing off the tube style bumpers.

[Homegrown]

[If this was addressed above, then I didnt understand and apologize]

Similar problem to what I understand above: What is the solution to a bolt that snapped off while removing the nut from inner sway bar bushing bracket? The bolt appears to be through the frame, but I cannot think of a DIY solution.

I suppose its not required to just get the car reassembled and running, but should be fixed relatively soon.

[18Fiatsandcounting]

Regarding a snapped off stud, the best solution (although not necessarily the easiest) is to take it to a shop that can drill out the broken stud and weld a new one in place. If you have a welder, you can do this at home. The next best solution is to drill out the broken stud and tap new threads in the hole, and then use a bolt (instead of the original stud/nut) to secure this part of the bracket. The not-so-good solution is to bend the bracket so that you can secure it with a bolt in another location where you've tapped a hole, or spot-weld one side of the bracket to the frame.

Or, there is the ultimate lazy man approach to just remove the anti-sway bar. Both my '69 and '71 lost their sway bars decades ago, and for the casual puttering around town that I do, they're just fine without them. Obviously, if you're into performance, my lazy approach isn't for you!

-Bryan