Newbie goes for the Front end

[Kta124]

Hi There!

If I had to consider my personal skills as a mechanic I would say that I am really new to it. Never worked on a car with my father and so far, besides a oil change an replacing fuel lines (on the Fiat), I have never done much on a car… DIY never scared me and I love having my hands dirty I also have a mechanical engineering degree that I thought would help me undesrand what I may attempt to do… However that last point does not help much, knowing how to understand a drawing does not often say how to make it happen More over, I am French and reviewing all the vocabulary here in English is to me like starting back from scratch!

I am opening this post for anyone else, who like me may have never done much on a car and feel able to do so! I may also need the help of all the experts here in case I do something wrong...

Let's start, I bought a 124 in october as I loved this little car too much… I need to replace all the front bushings as they appear to be as old as the car is. Looking in here, I found very useful information, and ordered from AR some new all mounted A-arms and some sway bar bushings. I think I will change the tie rods as well. They look OK but rubber is cracked and may have lost some grease.

Taking everything apart, was not too complicated although I have a limited tool box (again, I am a young beginner!). The PO installed some X1/9 wheels, the wheel studs geometry is slightly different (from what I see in my books), nuts + studs instead of screws. No big deal but one that stayed attached as an assembly , I will clean the tread and re-install it:



The following is giving me more trouble:



The ball joints are stuck in there and do not want to get off the steering knuckle. I guess the conical part of it makes that happen. Any one of you guys having a trick on how to remove them? I donut's want to damage anything by hammering down anything… I even tried to have the sting help me,(not proud of that) but it did not made it…

I hope i will move forward soon and keep that post up to date, with as many pictures as possible! I will try to keep my posts shorter in the future, sorry about that

[azruss]

A couple of way to do this. first spray penetrating oil (PB blaster or WD-40) and let it soak. There is a tool called a pickle fork that any auto parts house will carry. this is a fork that is placed between the thick end of the taper and the steering knuckle. When you hammer the pickle fork in, it will separate the 2 pieces. It wont come easy. hammering the outside of the steering knuckle at the joint can help free it loose. You can also go to a tool rental place and rent a port-a-power. This is a hydraulic jack with a bunch of attachments. one will be a scissors jack. that can be placed between the 2 nuts and force them apart. This will be a 2 part process as they wont break free at the same time. wood (2x4) or plywood is good to use with the jack. This will trash the nuts, but you should be replacing them anyway. patience is a virtue with this operation. that custom bolt in the picture looks pretty trashed. Not sure those threads are savable.

[So Cal Mark]

a couple of observations;
the slides on the brake caliper shouldn't be painted. They should be clean and lubricated with caliper grease so that they allow the caliper to slide easily.
The lug bolts and studs you have are for aftermarket wheels that use a square shoulder to seat. Original wheels will use a conical seat bolt and the two can't be mixed

[majicwrench]

That big spring is trying to do all the work for you, it is trying to force those apart. So all you need to do is give em a wack with a hammer, right where the BJ stud goes thru. It will pop right apart. Don't go tap tap. Give it a good smack. Make sure nuts are on a few turns.
that stud in first pic has galled all sorts of thread material, you need some new parts there to be safe, or a helicoil.
Keith

[4uall]

this might help

http://fiatspider.com/f08/viewtopic.php ... it=+spring

[Kta124]

Thanks!
I will try to soak it and see what I can find as far as tools… A spray every day will help to tackle it next week end. I have a hammer though
Regarding these brakes, one of the PO did that, and he did so great that he even managed to paint 3 out of 4…
As far as the lug bolts and studs, from what I understood from some research, the wheels I have came from X1/9

Not sure if that is exactly the case or not, I will have to research it a little bit further and see If I find a standard part that matches. Not a lot of hope though
Jay, I read your thread at least twice already, it is really helpful, starting by the part selection thanks for sharing!
Olivier

[majicwrench]

You got a hammer that is all you need. Smack smack they will pop apart. Honest. I have done hundreds of ball joints. Your picture is perfect, nice easy shot at those. Hit the cast metal where the stud goes thru. It's just the taper holding it.

Would be nice if they hadn't painted the slides, but they will still work and it aint gonna kill ya.

What is gonna kill ya is that stud, Fiat only has four, they all need to be solid. You need a new hub, or a helicoil in your current hub. And a new stud/nut.

[redcars]

As far as the tie rod ends go one of the vendors cares new rubber for them. I inspected mine cleaned then put in new grease and put the new rubber on them and good to go. I would rather spend time than money on things, but that is just me. Everything else that you have been told sounds good.

[Kta124]

Thanks for all these information!
I was thinking about changing the tie-rods, but removing them I may harm the center-link as well and that + that + that + shipping = a lot of $$$… I guess that re-grease + rubber looks like the best solution here! What type of grease do you use, regular bearing grease ? I may change the rods and refresh the rest.

Also I was getting more lucky in getting that strut separated from the nut, I just put it in the bottom of a fruit plastic bag, sprayed it generously with WD40 roll up the bag around and let it literally soak for one day. The next day, vise + channel lock made it come apart easy. After somme quick cleaning it looks like that :



The thread is not looking so great I will need to change the stud (already have sourced some M12x1.25x45mm) it but got somehow worried about my hub… To test it, I used the clean part of the stud and tried to bolt it in the hub. I made a couple turns by hand and it got stuck. I guess it looks inside as bad as that strut … I did not force not to damage it anything further.
Do you have any good way to rescue that? Probably rethread it I guess.
I noticed all the struts are not bolted through the complete thread available on the hub, meaning I have 4-ish clean unused thread left at the rear side of the hub. I can maybe be use them to realign a new thread...

[majicwrench]

I would get a new (used) hub, cheap easy, or get a helicoil. This is a safety thing. Be safe.
Why change tie rod ends unless they are bad??
Any grease will do for tie rods etc.
Keith

[azruss]

you will find the tie-rod balls are not metal and there isnt much room for grease. I use lithium with mine and worked it in a lot. AR sells new OEM style rubber ball joint seals. they fit great.

[Kta124]

Thanks,

I got one out, I used a big 1-1/8" wrench instead of a pickle fork, it worked after a few smashes…
One end is almost stuck, rubber was off and had no grease left, it nearly moves. The other one got the rubber damaged during removing but seems to work great. I will renew them as you guys suggest. It's a great Idea!
My first son was born yesterday , I am really happy and looking forward to some take days off to enjoy him and having time stuck at home to work on the car!

[4uall]

congrats on the boy

[Kta124]

This las few days were quite productive. I found and ordered the studs I will need along with a used hub that I found on ebay.
As the baby boy was sleeping (and my wife too ) I had a few hours to work on these ball joints.
Following the video I found somewhere on the forum http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3LC9MxUCvI8 (posted by 4uall if I remember), I removed the front hub and back-spalch to get more room around there. Then following what I was told here, I smacked it hard! And harder a few other times… I used another hammer resting on the A arm as a punch to give me more "smacking" area.

The bottom joint came out first. I got tired of smashing it and the top one would not come. I tried to be inventive and I found a bushing and a matching screw I had in a drawer. It basically it made me an adjustable spacer… I spanned it up to when my wrench was biting the steel ruining the hex shape of it. Nothing...

Then living the spacer there, I smashed it hard again, and it came off after a few hits
I tried to remove the spring as I saw on a video here, without the spring compressor (which I don't have), but looks like my springs are too long, or something. They are still under some moderate compression when the A arm is all down (pulling up I can move the A-arm back up a little). I don't want to force it open, the car is on stands and I don't want to mess to much with it and finish with a spring jumping on my tiny toes… I guess I will go to rent one someday soon. To make that more efficient I starred the same process on the passenger side, so I will need the spring compressor only once.

@4uall: Thanks for the wishes, and the videos

[4uall]

Hmmmmm They should just drop out, could always use a crow bar to pry them a little.






Try putting a jack underneath when putting them back in

scratched the crap out my poor springs