Timing issues...HELP!

[Lvspider2k]

Okay, I apologize if I missed a post on this elsewhere but I'm a really confused. I'm in the middle of a timing belt change. I got the new belt on and while turning the engine by hand to ensure there was no binding, I thought it would be a good time to re-torque my aux pulley bolt..dumb idea! In doing so, the belt jumped a few teeth before I realized what I did. No worries, I loosened the tensioner and started back at square one.

I made sure everything was lined back up and put the belt back on. Then I had the idea of checking the distributor and now I'm totally confused. The distributor is pointing at the number 1 cylinder while the crank pulley is lined up perfectly with TDC and the other pulley marks are all lined up with the appropriate timing marks.

What gives? I should have checked the distributor before I took everything apart but I didn't because I assumed it wasn't already 180 degrees off. I know the aux shaft only moved about a quarter turn and the intake pulley moved about three teeth. the exhaust pulley was right on and the crank may have moved about 1/4 turn before i rest everything back in order.

Isn't the dizzy supposed to be lined up to fire cylinder 4 at TDC? Any help would be greatly appreciated! I'm going to take a break and go back out after dinner.

[Lvspider2k]

Sorry for my ignorance, I got a little excited! My car is a 79 2L. I finally caught my breath and it appears from some other posts that the distributor labels may be the issue. My understanding now is that the #1 cylinder is one closest to the timing belt but it is label "4" on the distributor, is this correct?

So firing order is 1-3-2-4?

The engine and the dizzy both turn clockwise when looking at them?

If yes to all, crisis averted...

Thanks again for any assistance and I apologize for not stating this info initially. This forum has great info!

Kevin

[131]

At TDC with both cam wheels aligned with timing marks, the rotor button should be pointing at the plug lead for number 4, the rear cylinder.

[Lvspider2k]

Mick, so it appears that my plug wires may be backwards after all? So 4 on the dizzy is the #4 cylinder and so on? That may explain why it ran without much power before. What about the other posts i've seen that claim that "1 is 4"?

It back fired some before I went into do the timing belt, but it sounded like it was coming from the exhaust, not the intake. I am doing a 1800 intake swap at the same time because the 28/32 ADHA was a POS, even after it was rebuilt. Would the engine run with the plug wires backwards? i realize that is a dumb question, but its been 15 years since i've played with a real, non-electronic everything engine, so I'm questioning my logic. I haven't run it much since I moved it from Cali over a year ago.

Kevin

[BEEK]

the crankshaft timing mark comes up at tdc and again at 180 out, the cams are only alligned when the motor is at tdc. at tdc the distributor rotor should be firing to #4, it is possible to use a timing light on #1 and set the ignition timing. although not recomended.

[redcars]

Your firing order is 1-3-4-2 that is why it does not matter if you use #1 or #4 to time the ignition, but only the ignition.

[maytag]

don't get confused by any of this. 1 is not 4. 1 is 1. This motor needs the ignition to be timed to #4 when all the marks are lined-up, Like BEEK said. (although I don't know why he'd discourage putting a timing-light on the #1 wire, since the crank is in exactly the same position when #1 is firing as it is when #4 is firing.)

When the marks are all lined-up, (so obviously #4 is at TDC) the ignition rotor should be pointed at the #4 terminal INSIDE the distributor cap. This is important: it should NOT be pointed where the $4 post is on the OUTSIDE of the cap. If you trace the path from the post down, you'll notice the terminals inside do NOT line-up with the posts outside.

[fiatmike124]

Maytag, why should we never use the posts as marked on the outside of the cap IF they are in the correct order. Intuitively, I would assume that using the inside of the cap would risk someone plugging the wires to the wrong post in the future. Please help me understand this. Thanks.

[BEEK]

don't get confused by any of this. 1 is not 4. 1 is 1. This motor needs the ignition to be timed to #4 when all the marks are lined-up, Like BEEK said. (although I don't know why he'd discourage putting a timing-light on the #1 wire, since the crank is in exactly the same position when #1 is firing as it is when #4 is firing.)

it just doesn't seem proper

[BEEK]

in my days as a mechanic, i have had customers bring cars to me and say it wont run. i pointed the rotor to the #4 cylinder. they did just that, the rotor pointed to the #4 plug, not where it was on the cap, but the plug location in the engine. it is all in the understanding of what is being said. the fingers on the outside of the cap do not represent the internal locations of the firing posts, one can follow the path internally of the cap and see which post is truly #4 inside, not real complicated. thats all.

[fiatmike124]

I'm am on meds in the hospital and forgot that the cap had the fingers out the side. When I wrote that I was picturing a cap where the internal firing posts are located directly below the posts coming out the top. I realize now how dumb my post must have read

[Lvspider2k]

I apologize for mis-typing the firing order, I meant 1-3-4-2. I have verified that the distributor rotor is pointing to the internal terminal that linked to the plug wire connection labeled #1. I verified continuity using an ohm meter so I know which internal terminal runs to which external (I have stopped 'assuming' everything at this point!) If the engine indeed turns clockwise (as well as the dizzy...please verify), then the number 4 cylinder is under compression coming up on TDC with the timing marks aligned.

My question remains, should the distributor be firing at cylinder #1 or #4 at TDC with the cam pulley marks lined up? It appears by the cap to indicate the number 1 cylinder which is why I asked the question about the labeling which was indicated on another post. Sorry, I know these seem like stupid questions but I want to make sure I understand before putting everything back together.

I took pictures but I haven't figured out how to post them yet. I'm working on that next.

Thanks again!

Kevin

[BEEK]

#4 at tdc

p.s. the only dumb question is the one you already know the answer to.

[Lvspider2k]

Beek,

Thanks for the verification, I wanted to make sure I wasn't going crazy. The distributor does appear to be labeled incorrectly as it is pointing to fire at the "1" plug wire post even though that wire was routed to the #4 cylinder at TDC with the marks aligned...strange! Could it be that I have an early model cap on a late model distributor?

Kevin

[BEEK]

what happened is someone assembled it and thought the timing was to be set to #1 at tdc. the car was 180 degrees out so instead of repositioning the distributor, they just moved the wires