uneven tire wear

81SPIDERMATT · Post by **81SPIDERMATT** » Sat Apr 16, 2011 12:38 pm

ok before you ask... new control arm bushings (tightened with wheels on ground and weight in car)... new ball joints , shocks, wheel bearings and alighnment ( also weighted when done)
no rust around shock towers
somewhere i read about shcok towers falling in or body itself collapsing
i am needing some help diagnosing what it could be.... getting ready monday to go back to alignment shop and ask them to look at it but thought i would come here too

although there are some easy fixies on this car i fear i might be in for something major.... which i dont mind i just want to be doing the right thing

PLEASE AND THANK YOU

also some alignment jargon might help me talk to the mechanic more effectivly

azruss · Post by **azruss** » Sat Apr 16, 2011 2:58 pm

ask the alignment shop to check caster and camber. If camber is off, it could create odd wear. check for bent rims. how old are your tires. I assume the alignment shop checked for play in the tie rods. If your steering linkage has play, then the alignment will change when you are driving.

So Cal Mark · Post by **So Cal Mark** » Sat Apr 16, 2011 2:58 pm

did the alignment shop note the settings on the repair order? If so, I'd ask them to recheck the settings and compare them to what the original alignment was. Camber and toe are the two angles that affect tire wear

81SPIDERMATT · Post by **81SPIDERMATT** » Sat Apr 16, 2011 3:17 pm

tires are new... will check the paperwork for specs... guess i will know more on monday.... going to have the tires balanced before going to the alignment shop... they should be able to tell if the rims are bent.. right??

majicwrench · Post by **majicwrench** » Sat Apr 16, 2011 4:53 pm

What sort of wear??? Over how many miles?? Huge fat tires or nice stock street stuff?? Factory rims?? You zooming thru corners or driving like an old man, like I do??
Balance will not create tire wear. Bent rims won't hardly create wear either, and yes, anybody balancing your tires wil be able to tell if rims bent.
Like Mark said, camber and toe are the biggies that cause wear.

81SPIDERMATT · Post by **81SPIDERMATT** » Sat Apr 16, 2011 5:49 pm

inside edge of both tires and it is the very inside edge.... looking at the tires from the front it looks like they are angled out at the bottom..after the alignment the car drove much nicer but got under it to attach some hood trim and noticed the tire wear .... passenger is a little worse than drivers...186-65 r14 on aftermarket rims.... aggressive driving habits... tires were new when i purchased car about 3k miles ago

v6spider · Post by **v6spider** » Sun Apr 17, 2011 12:51 am

Check the camber with a protractor level... too much caster will cause the tires to scrub...an alignment on a machine at an alignment shop is only as good as the calibration of the machine...also check shock towers where they attach at the top... the sheet metal in the engine compart where the tower attachs should be flat... if it is bulged inward they could be collapsing inward.

81SPIDERMATT · Post by **81SPIDERMATT** » Sun Apr 17, 2011 3:03 pm

ok i don't know what camber is or a protractor level either .... the sheet metal where i think you are talking about looks flat to me but i have nothing to compare it to ... let's say that they are collapsing... what would have to happen to fix it... like i said i will hopefully know more tomorrow after the shop visit... also are there things that i can check with the cross member when it is up on the lift????????????????????????????????

majicwrench · Post by **majicwrench** » Sun Apr 17, 2011 3:46 pm

Camber...if you are looking at the car from in front, and can see the tires tipping in at the top, that is called negative camber. If the tires tipped out at the top, that would be positive camber. Perfectly straight up and down would be 0 camber.

Most cars run slightly positive camber. Driving aggressively, car will handle better with a tiny bit of negative camber. Too much negative camber will seriously wear the inside of the tires, like your are doing.

Alignment shop specs should note what your camber is at, and also what it SHOULD be.

Fiats end up with negative camber as things start collapsing. Also, upper ball joints on fiats are prone to failure, and as they wear tires start tipping in at top.

Jack up fiat one tire at time by placing jack under control arm. Now grab tire top and bottom and see how much play in and out. SHould be almost none.

Typing negitive camber into search should bring up a bunch of stuff.
If camber is way too negative and your alignement shop said nothing, I would think about finding a diff shop.

v6spider · Post by **v6spider** » Sun Apr 17, 2011 11:43 pm

Matt: Sorry about the short reply but I was on my droid...What Majicwrench is saying explains it pretty well a protractor level measures angles in degrees they are at sears and they are relatively cheap. Stock camber on your car is at 0 degrees. If it is as majicwrench describing... there will need to be some welding, straightening and reenforcing to be done on the structure of the front end... I am considering doing it to my v6 spider before it becomes an issue because I believe that it can be prevented with a little reenforceing prior to assembly... especially since my power plant is heavier and 300+ hp

i hope that your towers are not collapsing..

Rob

81SPIDERMATT · Post by **81SPIDERMATT** » Tue Apr 19, 2011 11:19 am

sick baby... looking like thursday before i can get to alignment shop..... is there some type of brace that goes across the engine bay that would push the chock towers back out.... will a welder know what to do if i have to do welding that has been described... or is a auto body shop the way to go... planning for the worst .. hoping for the best.....

majicwrench · Post by **majicwrench** » Tue Apr 19, 2011 12:30 pm

I wouldn't jump to conclusions yet.

v6spider · Post by **v6spider** » Thu Apr 21, 2011 2:29 am

Best thing to do is take it to a body shop that has a frame jig. Only if you can see some obvious changes in camber to the negative...again the protractor gauge is an easy inexpensive way to find out and keep track of it and see if it progresses.

Rob

azruss · Post by **azruss** » Thu Apr 21, 2011 2:46 am

another quick way to check camber is to get the car on a flat service. use a framing square and set it on the ground perpendicular to the tire. take a tape measure and measure the distance between the bottom of the rim and the square. do the same with the top.
Here is another thing to check (have found this on most of my spiders). look at the box frame running inside the fender that connects to the top of the shock tower. check to see if the box frame is cracked on either side of the shock tower. if you have undercoating, you may need to remove it for the inspection. look close. these cracks can hide easily.

81SPIDERMATT · Post by **81SPIDERMATT** » Thu Apr 21, 2011 5:35 pm

SO THE SHOP SAYS... lower ball joints have play ( just replaced with iap units) .. do new parts go bad that quickly... is there another brand that is better?????? ... and outer tie rods on both sides have play... ( the same one they said were fine 3 weeks ago..... going to another shop that was recommended by the first shop... go figure.... monday appt.... will look for cracks this weekend... afraid to use a framing square... i can see it is a good fat inch or more the tires ore out... (negative camber if i am learning).... thanks for the help ... the car that i love is trying my resolve...... matt

uneven tire wear

uneven tire wear

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